OR-GOV: Tax Dodging and GOP outrage, when it's a Democrat
Carla Axtman
In July, the state of Massachusetts was all a-flutter with the news that Senator John Kerry was mooring his fancy new yacht in Rhode Island, thus avoiding the roughly $500,000 in taxes he'd have owed had he chosen to tie up in his home state.
Upon discovering this information, Massachusetts Republicans went on the warpath against Kerry. Conservative radio host Howie Carr threw everything but the kitchen sink at Kerry while flogging the story. The rightwing leaning Boston Herald gleefully posted video on their website of a frazzled Kerry, hounded by media, fighting off their questions while trying to press through their surge. The same was done by the righty blogging site NewsMax, who salivated over the story like a dog responding to Pavlov.
Of course now that the shoe is on the other foot, and the tax dodger is Oregon GOPer Chris Dudley, the GOP newspapers and talk show hosts are tight-lipped. He's not a Democrat, after all. If this were Kitzhaber, the rightwing media circuit would be in a froth.
There are some differences in this story, of course. Kerry is a Senator and has been an advocate of raising taxes on the wealthy, including himself. Dudley is a former basketball player who ditched out on Oregon by his own admission to dodge taxes. Kerry is more than willing to pony up for his state, demonstrating his commitment. Dudley, not so much.
In the end, Carr and company ultimately had the Kerry story wrong. Kerry doesn't own the yacht. His wife's company does, which is in Pittsburgh, not Massachusetts. The boat had been seen off Nantucket, and the state was already looking into whether the taxes would be owed, but apparently hadn't finished the investigation. Kerry paid the $500,000 tax anyway, presumably to get the story out of the media. But then, Kerry can afford it and after all, is willing to pay more because it's the right thing to do. Dudley admits outright that he took the advice of his accountant and moved to Camas, Washington in order to avoid paying Oregon income tax, and so far, none of us know how much Oregon's revenue was shorted due to Dudley's decision.
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8:40 a.m.
Sep 7, '10
I had forgotten about the Kerry yacht kerfuffle. Excellent point, Carla.
I ran across one media source already over the weekend, calling on Dudley to release his tax returns. What is the favorite throw-away line of the Right? "If he's got nothing to hide..."
12:47 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
Has Kitzhaber ever released any of his tax returns?
1:40 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
That's a good question, Jack. And did Kitzhaber move out of Oregon on the advice of his accountant in order to avoid paying Oregon income tax, ask Dudley did? Let's treat both candidates the same.
4:13 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
But Dudley didn't avoid paying Oregon income tax, Carla. In fact, he probably paid more Oregon income tax while living in Washington than you will pay in your lifetime.
4:22 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
So you are calling Dudley a liar then when he said with his own lips that he moved to Camas to avoid paying Oregon taxes?
6:11 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
I just looked at the KGW primary debate again where Chris talked about this and he said "he saved a few dollars" rather than that he "avoided paying Oregon taxes."
And by the way, Mitchell, you may need to see a doctor. Your posts below about economic development incentives are making far too much sense. You may have caught something. :-)
8:58 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
LOL, yeah, he saved a few dollars by avoiding paying taxes he would have paid if he lived in Oregon.
12:05 a.m.
Sep 10, '10
Maybe the better question would be what about Oregon's tax structure makes it attractive for people with big incomes to move across the river? Wouldn't you rather have someone running the state who was interested in saving money he didn't have to spend? Oprah Winfrey limits her number of nights she spends at her house in California just to avoid paying their abusive taxes. Does that mean she doesn't love California or just their addiction to her money? Maybe just maybe if we are able to elect Dudley he will be able to change things to the extent that both people and businesses will find Oregon to be a more attractive climate for them financially
8:38 a.m.
Sep 8, '10
Oh sure Jack.....just like the thief who walked out of the store w/ out paying for the merchandise. The thief didn't actually steal anything, he just "saved a few dollars."
11:52 a.m.
Sep 8, '10
You might want to read the Willamette Week article on this, Jack. It's looking like Dudley attempted to make it appear like he lived in WA in order to have the advantage of avoiding our income tax, but did actually live here in Oregon. Is that even legal?
http://wweek.com/editorial/3644/14492/
11:55 a.m.
Sep 8, '10
Not to my knowledge. But questions of his state citizenship never came up. You're looking for parity. There is none here. The whole point of Carla's article is that when the shoe is on the other foot, the Right screams but it's just savvy common sense when it's your guy.
12:00 a.m.
Sep 10, '10
The difference is that John Kerry is a tax cheat and Chris Dudley is just getting smeared by left wingers with nothing substantive to say. ...that's a huge difference
11:18 a.m.
Sep 13, '10
This needs to be addressed prior to the election, in both parties. If Chris Dudley goes down because of this, Oregon conservatives will have missed a perfect opportunity to vote for the only truly constitutional conservative to govern Oregon.
CP candidate Greg Kord is fully deserving of the GOP's platform Pro-Life endorsement and avoidance of deficit spending for college education (www.gregkord.com), where eagles dare to fly.
9:24 a.m.
Sep 7, '10
Silly carla, IOKIYOR. you know that. BTW, do you know why one of my comments asking Jack Bogdanski when he was moving to Camas was deleted?
12:44 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
Tick off Bog and he will banish you from this site as well. :-)
2:05 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
He already did.
I had the temerity to point out it was a bit silly to claim that Paul Krugman "was agreeing with him" (and not the other way around) when I am all but certain Paul Krugman couldn't pick Bog out of a police line-up.
That Bog also regularly makes stupid claims that development tax breaks to get companies to relocate to Oregon (and the city of Portland) "costs" the city and state money is pure bullcrap. Not charging a business a tax doesn't "cost" the state or city a dime more than not giving the tax break and not having the business move here at all.
But that is par for the course with professional complainers like Bog.
7:52 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
You were banned from my site because you behaved badly. As you are doing now. I didn't think Blue Oregon went in for the ad hominem stuff, but maybe that was back before it became a Facebook app dominated by a few people.
8:51 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
Wow. Now you are flat out lying. I never "behaved badly" unless you are claiming that me pointing out that it was a bit arrogant of you to claim that Krugman was agreeing with you and not the other way around, is behaving badly.
You have a well known rep for banning anyone who calls you on anything.
10:48 a.m.
Sep 8, '10
While there may be less participation in the discussions at this point (more people seem to be getting on board,) the overall quality of the commentary has been quite a bit better....in my humble opinion. I certainly don't miss all the anonymous right-wingers constantly spewing insults and empty Republican talking points. There's a reason I don't watch FOX Noise.
11:58 a.m.
Sep 8, '10
You're free to not visit here. In fact, this site seems to be meant for a Left leaning readership. Not some place for the Right to come here and flame us.
3:51 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
MG, I'm not aware of any comments having been deleted. Probably a technical glitch in posting it.
4:23 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
Could be I suppose. I know it usually needs to be really out of bounds for you to delete comments, and while mine was certainly sarcastic, wasn't crossing any lines.
9:29 a.m.
Sep 7, '10
Kerry, who I voted for, lives in MA. Had the story been true, there would have been some merit to the idea he was doing something wrong.
Dudley actually lived in Camas, where he paid sales and property taxes to support the infrastructure where he lived.
10:28 a.m.
Sep 7, '10
Any bets he did more than a little shopping in Oregon to avoid sales taxes?
And again, do you think it is a good thing for someone who wants to be Governor to have been actively trying to avoid paying taxes in the state he would later want to be Governor of?
10:54 a.m.
Sep 7, '10
Doesn't bother me any more than someone who gets married to portray an image and then gets divorced as soon as they are out of office.
11:02 a.m.
Sep 7, '10
Glad to see you view tax-dodging as no big deal.
BTW, how many budgets has Dudley ever balanced?
How many jobs has Dudley ever created?
How many organizations has Dudley ever managed?
How many elections has Dudley missed voting in?
12:00 p.m.
Sep 8, '10
The Willamette Week makes the case that Dudley's house in Camas may have been a facade.
http://wweek.com/editorial/3644/14492/
If you can vouch that Dudley actually LIVED in Camas, then I am sure they would like to talk to you to give that side of the story.
11:00 a.m.
Sep 7, '10
How many BO'ers take the Oregon tax credit for political contributions? You are not required to. Aren't you dodging taxes? Taxes that could be used on roads or schools? Why do you hate the kids? :-)
11:05 a.m.
Sep 7, '10
Taking perfectly valid deductions within the Oregon tax code and moving to another state so as to avoid taxes are not even close to being in the same universe let alone the same thing.
You should however consider wrapping yourself in copper wire and putting yourself between two magnets. The amount of spinning you are doing could be a potential boon in renewable energy production. Do it for the kids.
;)
11:36 a.m.
Sep 7, '10
And the tax credit is only $100. It's not like we're talking about hundreds of thousands of dollars.
12:43 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
What makes you think we are talking about hundreds of thousands with Dudley? Prior to coming to PDX, he earned roughly $3.5M in 5 years. Subtract federal and state taxes, agent commissions and advisor fees, we're not talking about a lot of dividend income potential.
2:07 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
Sure we are. Unless you think $300k+ is not a lot.
2:42 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
Where did you get that number?
4:24 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
9% on 3.5 million.
11:07 a.m.
Sep 7, '10
Well, I never have, for one. I'm sure there are others.
12:01 p.m.
Sep 8, '10
This is a joke, right?
4:44 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
Dudley's lack of basic fitness for the job of Governor, the utter absence of real solutions in his campaign rhetoric, and his unwillingness to enter into any open discussions of the issues important to Oregonians, are all combining to make it very difficult to maintain my neutrality in this race.
Then there's the fact that his connection to Oregon, other than as a source of employment, was so weak that he chose to live in Washington. One wonders which state his cars were registered in during those years.
His "plans" are no plans at all, just rhetoric and empty ideological dreams, with no budget numbers or revenue sources attached to anything, except for the new fees he proposes to put on the sale and distribution of liquor, although he has yet to say how much the fees will be, who will pay them and where the money will be collected.
He also says that he wants to enlarge the office of the governor with new posts, commissions and committees, all at undisclosed public expense, and yet his supporters exhibit no interest at all in how expensive this would be.
I'm waiting for the details, some real budget numbers and, yes, I'm joking about the neutrality.
5:07 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
@ Mitchell Gore (reply function isn't working) "That Bog also regularly makes stupid claims that development tax breaks to get companies to relocate to Oregon (and the city of Portland) "costs" the city and state money is pure bullcrap. Not charging a business a tax doesn't "cost" the state or city a dime more than not giving the tax break and not having the business move here at all."
Actually if the business would have moved here anyway the tax break does cost $$.
5:36 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
First of all, the examples I was referring to is about companies that were courted to move here via the tax breaks. SO a reduced amount of tax revenue on a company that relocated here is better than no jobs and no tax revenue from said business for the state if it didn't move here. To say nothing about the revenue form the individual income taxes of the newly employed workers of said company.
Second, perhaps it is my exhaustion over the use of language in terms like "saving" and "cost" which are so polluted by marketing these days (and I admit my guilt in that I work in field) that I refuse to let people toss about terms incorrectly without comment.
If I get 20% off of the price of something, I didn't "savE" any money. I simply spent less than I could have. Saving money means not spending money. Likewise, the state not getting some potential tax revenue is not "costing" the state anything. The state isn't cutting a check in these cases, but simply not collecting some revenue or fees.
And in the cases I am referring to, getting 100% tax revenue on a company that balks at moving to Oregon is worth precisely zero dollar,s but a getting a reduce tax revenue forma company that moves into the state is bringing in money to the state and not "costing:" the state (particularly when factoring in the taxes that workers for said company will pay via income tax, etc.).
But Bog uses any and all misleading rhetoric to constantly scream about how anything the Gov. does is wrong as he plays his "heads I win, tails you lose" game of crap flinging.
One minute he screams about how Gov. isn't helping bring jobs to the state (or city) then when the GOv. does, he complains about the incentives the GOv. does to get companies to bring jobs into the state.
He is a professional complainer, best paid attention to in very small, and caveated doses.
5:10 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
My belief is that there are far better grounds to oppose Dudley do right (wing) than the tax issue.
He has no ideas or vision beyond basic platitudes that make Reagan's 1984 "morning in america" BS seem substantive.
As one might say: there's no "there" there.
5:38 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
But it isn't a zero sum game. He is both an empty suit who seems to be totally devoid of real ideas or policy plans, AND he is a tax-dodging dilettante.
6:12 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
Chris "Oakland" Dudley!
9:07 p.m.
Sep 7, '10
I am sure that Dudley paid more in Oregon taxes that Kitzhaber over the same period of time. Plus, he contributed to the Washington tax base, the home of many Blazer fans.
He did nothing illegal or subversive. He made a decision regarding what to do with his personal property. Perhaps he gave some of that tax savings to charity? He has given millions (again, probably much more than Kitzhaber). Good for him.
This is a non-issue.
11:26 a.m.
Sep 8, '10
More in dollars maybe, but less as a percentage of income.
12:22 a.m.
Sep 10, '10
so what?
10:32 a.m.
Sep 8, '10
Maybe the exposure over carpetbagger Dudley and his tax dodging is pushing down Dudley's numbers. Poll just out on the O. Kitz up by nine points: http://www.oregonlive.com/politics/index.ssf/2010/09/poll_shows_uncertain_fate_for.html
12:10 p.m.
Sep 8, '10
Encouraging (the Gov. numbers and the casino numbers) but I'll take Our Oregon's word about as far as I could collectively throw them.