Which one of these two will still be in government in February?

That is change I can believe in! :)

That picture should have never been taken. Cheney should be long gone serving time in some dank prison cell. However the only real group of people that could have made that happen - the Democrats in Congress - chose to let it slide in the hopes they could strengthen there hold on power in 2008.
It worked, but at what a price. When those kids in the picture grow up they're going to have some serious questions about why Daddy was shaking hands with a war criminal. Nancy Pelosi has a lot to answer for. We all do. The Democratic Party makes me sick. The Republicans gave us the crime - the Democrats embraced the criminals. If America falls, historians will look back at the Election of 2006 as the year the last chance was lost - not because of the result - but because of the spineless accomplices who slithered forth from the Democratic Party and gave Dick Cheney a loving kiss.

I hope after the pleasantries Merkely washed his hands.

in Iodine.

It's unclear if what we're seeing - especially economically - is the end of our national nightmare or the end of our nation. These last two years, America needed desperately to be self-correcting yet the Dems were content with coddling President Bush and rolling over for him on everything from funding the Iraq War to torture. These were years we could not afford to waste. The Democratic leadership in Congress made a cynical gamble to bide our time, and as the trillions in debt pile up, it sure looks like it cost us, perhaps fatally as a nation. Pelosi and Reid are beyond duds because they could have been American heroes.
This picture with Cheney is a tragedy. It represents a tremendous failure of a nation's ability to hold its leaders accountable to the law - not to mention the moral failure that goes along with that. What we needed were Congressional leaders who believed in the Constitution but not just when it's politically expedient. What we needed were Congressional leaders willing to do the right thing even if it cost them their jobs...even if it cost them their lives. What we got was a stinking swamp of acquiescence. As we race towards bankruptcy and a worthless dollar, it remains to be seen if our time as a nation is now running out.

Looks like Dennis Kucinich, fearless Progressive and true Democrat that he is, has put Democrats and Republicans, the outgoing and incoming administration alike, that the nature of our support for Israel and those politicians responsible for that support like Wyden, and we can confidently predict Merkley will be unless he decides his career depends on him hitching his political fortunes to other wagons, is is finally now on the table .

And in late breaking news, Burris has totally pwned Reid and the entire Democratic leadership, including Wyden and the man who will have "plenty to say after 1/20", who lined up with ill-advised bluster behind him:

Knowledgeable Senate officials of both parties widely predicted that the saga would end with Burris being seated. They spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to speak publicly.

In politics things can change over night, but for now it sure looks like the Democratic Party as configured around the new legislative and executive leadership is already as over as the Republican Party. It is just going to take the continued economic collapse and ongoing foreign policy disasters to make it clear to us by the end of 2009 what most Oregonians and Americans elsewhere already know about themselves. The impolite victory dance by Carla and a lot of you gives rise to a sad and sickening sense of just how out of touch those who define the face of the Democratic Party are with the people of Oregon and the country.

The most annoying thing about Cheney is the stupidity of his argument about executive power. We all know why America was founded - to get past authoritarian rule with a 3-branch system of checks and balances. The obvious question is why did we bother if Cheney is right and the Founding Fathers meant us to have an all-powerful ruler after all? His argument makes no sense. I also am annoyed when the articles suggest Cheney sought total power to implement his agenda. Getting total power WAS Cheney's agenda. That's what gives him his high. The various other things including an undeniable cruel streak when it comes to shooting little birds and waterboarding detainees, are just the perks of the job. But the job was to become all powerful and he did while Pelosi and Reid cowered in the corner. In case you think this is a demented rant, let me quote a couple of paragraphs from Maureen Dowd: "Congress, which abdicated its oversight role as the Bush crew wrecked the globe and the economy, desperately needs fresh faces and new perspectives, an infusion of class, intelligence and guts." She goes on to say the Senate was "shamefully sparse on profiles in courage during Dick Cheney’s reign of terror." Carla's distain for Cheney makes a lot of sense, but where's the anger over her own team? Since 2006 the Democrats have shared the responsibility for some of the most disgraceful governing in American History.

It looks like Burris is going to join him, per the news release this morning.

Wow! Having a Gov who will likely be removed for reasons of fraud naming the replacement is real CHANGE I CAN BELIEVE IN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What backbone the Dems have!

What does Blago have on Obama and/or his Ch. of Staff?

Give it up already.

Bush/Cheney are out...Obama/Biden are in. You should be rejoicing.

So Merkley gets sworn in, after defeating a Republican, and all you can do is demean Cheney?

This is no different than Republicans who can't let go of their disdain for Bill Clinton. Get over it!

Criticizing Cheney is no different from the Republicans going after Clinton? You must think oral sex is a war crime and if it is you're doing it wrong. I'd compare this more to the pass we gave Richard Nixon because we just couldn't put the country through the sight of one of our Presidents charged as a common citizen. Well, maybe Dick Cheney - who worked for Nixon - would have stayed in the lines a little more if he saw Nixon prosecuted. Presidents and Vice Presidents are not monarchs. They don't get to become the law. I rejoice that the Bush administration is nearly over but we have a lot to answer for: How did these criminals stay in power so long? The only thing that's flushing them is the Constitution. What if they had showed as much regard for that part as they did for the rest of it?

The sounds of crickets on the Blago stuff.

How expected.

This is no different than Republicans who can't let go of their disdain for Bill Clinton. Get over it!

Get over it? It's not even over. When Bush and his band of thieves leave the White House, I expect you'll find none of the vitriol that (still!) animates the GOP. Bush is beneath our contempt. History is already rendering a verdict from which he will never emerge. The reason the GOP continued to hate Clinton was that he was relatively successful; the more the Bush regime wore on, the more successful Clinton looked--and the more GOPpers chafed.

As for the handshake, I think it's wonderful that Merkley is getting to shake Dick's hand. It shows that in a functioning democracy, we have a peaceful transition of power. It's as if Merkley is saying, "Thanks, Dick, but we'll take it from here."

Sweet.

The sounds of crickets on the Blago stuff.

How expected.

Oh no, Kari, Karol, Charlie, and Carla--Scott's on to us!

"This is no different than Republicans who can't let go of their disdain for Bill Clinton. Get over it!"

The difference is that after January 20, 2009, I will never give Dick/Bush et al another thought the rest of my life.

Why is it that conservatives still salivate at the thought of Bubba 8 years later?

Echo what We Dems tried to say.

mp, you're confusing salivation with regurgitation.

torridjoe proves why the people who hang out here are not only clueless, they are a total embarrassment to those who recognize the Democratic Party is badly broken:

What this has to do with Obama, I have no idea.

Well, a week ago, the man said:

"Roland Burris is a good man and a fine public servant, but the Senate Democrats made it clear weeks ago that they cannot accept an appointment made by a governor who is accused of selling this very Senate seat. I agree with their decision, and it is extremely disappointing that Governor Blagojevich has chosen to ignore it. I believe the best resolution would be for the Governor to resign his office and allow a lawful and appropriate process of succession to take place. While Governor Blagojevich is entitled to his day in court, the people of Illinois are entitled to a functioning government and major decisions free of taint and controversy."

and today he's out there double-talking:

Obama did not publicly call for Reid to seat Burris. But no one could misread the President-elect's answer this morning to a question about the former Illinois attorney general who Blagojevich has named to fill Obama's vacant seat: "I think he's a fine public servant. If he gets seated then I'm going to work with Roland Burris just like I work with all the other senators to make sure that the people of Illinois and the people of the country are served."

Translation: Seat the guy

I think it's pretty clear that has everything to do with the O's ability to lead and the arrogance of inexperienced youth like so many of you here.

And it's sad just how it looks like our new "no commenter-in-chief" may just be another empty politician since he obviously doesn't have the moral character to lead. Of course, Clinton would have been absolutely no different, which gets back to just how we have let the Democratic Party be taken over by a real low class of people of which Merkley and Wyden are prime examples.

Posted by: Carla Axtman | Jan 7, 2009 12:03:40 PM

Uh..Blago is a douchebag.

I'm sure Saxby is jealous that I'm using his label for Blago.

in the "start yer own" spirit you are fond of... Have you seen the Dickipedia? You definitely need to start hosting the Dbagipedia.

I highly recommend their Sarah Palin entry. Well, on topic, I suppose I should have cited Cheney but that seems like shooting fish in a barrel. It does have a good recap of his role in the Nixon and Ford administrations.

Zarathustra--that's brilliant!

If I get the chance to squeeze more hours out of the day, I may just have to do that. LOL

I hope Cheney washed his hands after that...as an Oregonian I'm so embarrassed for our state for sending a complete joke of a candidate like Merkley to the Senate. With the deep bench Dems have in this state, so many qualified individuals to choose from, the fact that we are stuck with this ass clown for the next 6 years is an abomination. Wake me up in 6 years when Jeff gets sent packing back to his slumlord operation...if you're not embarrassed by this guy, you're not paying attention.

What utter bullshit, Marcus.

Speaking of embarrassed, you should be by that comment.

Wow Carla, very well reasoned response. Not that anyone expects much from you. I don't mean to crush the dreams of an aspiring fake journalist such as yourself, but I think it's time you find a real job and stop soiling the internet with your garbage. Do you honestly believe that Jeff Merkley is qualified to serve as a US Senator? Seriously? Come on, even you are smarter than that. Rather than hitching your wagon to every and any sworn flag burning, union whore liberal who appears on the ballot, try putting some thought into what it means to serve in the Congress and what kind of candidates really can and will represent not just our state but our nation as well. There is a long list of qualified Democrats and Republicans who could serve our state with distinction in the US Senate and you and I both know Merkley ain't on that list. We'd be better off leaving the seat vacant. Get over this guy, he's a one and done mistake...there's not many certainties on politics..but that's one of them.

I rejoice that the Bush administration is nearly over but we have a lot to answer for: How did these criminals stay in power so long? The only thing that's flushing them is the Constitution. What if they had showed as much regard for that part as they did for the rest of it?

If you were paying attention you would have noticed that the Constitution was trashed during the entire Bush presidency - not only by Bush and his administration but also by both parties in Congress and the American voters who voted these hypocrites back in office after they reneged on their oaths to uphold the Constitution.

But expect to be called on it.

Carla, you obviously think you are quite talented and are entitled to render summary opinions. (Frankly, thereby proving the truth of the dictum it is better to say nothing and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt, but I digress.) Why don't you demonstrate your superiority to us by providing us with your perceptive views on this story: Obama has little breathing room with Gaza mess: analysts.

Do you denounce Ron Wyden, a senator for 12 years now, for the major responsibility he bears for putting Obama in this mess by not demanding the over his career, and certainly in the last two weeks, demanding that the U.S. "impose limits on Israel instead of taking cues from it" as one analyst says, and by denouncing U.S. behavior towards Israel as "harming American interests and endangering people in the Middle East.".

Do you denounce Jeff Merkley, a guy I'll remind you had to have Schumer's DSCC run most of his media (and then said it wasn't his fault they were running negative ads in one of the debates) and to get Wyden to finally, reluctantly speak up for him to win, and who said in his victory speech "This transformation continues with the victory in this seat which puts 57 seats in a working majority that can work with Barack Obama to put this nation back on track.” and how he is part of a "transformational change for America" for his utter silence as this carnage has unfolded?

Or do you argue that Merkley's moral leadership is contingent on the oath of office like Obama? Do you criticize Obama for going a long way to put himself in this mess by his silence, dramatically worsening as one analyst describes it: "a backdrop of incredible bitterness and anger against Israel and, by implication, the United States."

As I said you obviously have an incredibly high opinion of yourself and your talent Carla. I'll just bet a lot of people here want to know just what have to say in your defense as an apologist and in defense of Merkley, Wyden, and Obama about all this. So why don't you oblige us?

And by the way do you defend or condemn Israel for the what is being widely reported that Israel blocked ambulances from reaching people in Gaza for over three days and shot and killed an aid worker during their supposed cease 3-hour cease fire..

Carla, you obviously think you are quite talented and are entitled to render summary opinions.

I think most everybody has opinions. You can choose to give mine weight or not.

Posted by: Kevin | Jan 8, 2009 10:16:19 AM

Posted by: We Democrats are as done as the GOP | Jan 8, 2009 8:16:33 AM

I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest that only an utter fool would presume to publically question the talent of another writer using, in part, a 73 word run-on sentence followed by a 107 word (!!!!!) run-on sentence.

awww...you just dismissed Husserl's entire preface to "The Phenomenology". Perhaps the exception that proves the rule, though I would call Husserl an utter fool. I don't believe WeThe's credentials are as solid.

having glibly quoted Socrates.

As long as we're splitting philosophical hairs, there's no such thing. You mean Plato?

Or, in a tone you feel comfortable with, "How do you expect We Democrats are as done as the GOP to take seriously a journalistic challenge with logic that I last saw on the Hotlips Pizza menu"? They seem to be under the similar impression that one can quote Socrates.

It's the name, We Democrats are as done as the GOP, isn't it? Now you know what it feels like seeing "progressive" in the title tag.

This photo makes me very proud to be an American.

Despite the (extremely) wide policy rift between Jeff Merkley and Dick Cheney, here we see -- just as we have seen time and time again (almost) without fail -- an image of a peaceful transition of power.

That's too rare in the world.

And of course Kevin provides a perfect example of the empty exultation of form over substance that characterizes a certain segment of Oregon (not really so) "progressive Democrats". Of course, I make no excuses for typos that mar what was posted, they are just typos.

Carla provides a prime example of the Wyden/Merkley/Obama "no comment" strategy. In typical fashion she also builds it around an empty snark, a tactic widely adopted by hipsters and hipster wannabes in the NW and across the nation. She and Kevin apparently don't quite realize that folks might notice that she and he ran away from actually stating an opinion at all.

Meanwhile, Merkley, Wyden and Obama stand by, their muteness making them complicit along with Carla and Kevin in the immoral and indefensible, as the U.N., the Red Cross, and the Vatican denounce the barbarity. As Naomi Klein demonstrates in a commentary that is remarkable even by the standards of "The Nation", we are on the cusp of a historic re-alignment by the true progressives and Democrats, and away from the pretenders like Merkley, Wyden, and those they count as supporters in places like Blue Oregon.

Just Foreign Policy announced there could be a senate resolution (written by AIPAC) on support for Israel's aggression against Gaza (not that the resolution will put it in those terms) today. It's a good bet that Wyden will vote for it. Merkley remains to be seen, but if Chuck Schumer has been leaning on him then it will be another good bet Merkley will make the Oregon vote unanimous.

Meanwhile, Merkley, Wyden and Obama stand by, their muteness making them complicit along with Carla and Kevin in the immoral and indefensible, as the U.N., the Red Cross, and the Vatican denounce the barbarity.

Okay...so basically I'm an immoral idiot complicit in barbarous bloodshed and injustice because I write about Oregon politics and issues?

Umm...over the top much?

Carla,

You're looking for logic/sense in all the wrong places.

Nice post, by the way.

No Carla, attempting to divert attention from your shallowness won't work. You are complicit because you were asked to express your opinion on the political behavior of two Oregon politicians you hyped, and instead of answering the question, you respond with excuses and snarky comments.

And Kevin, despite the juvenile level of form over substance you demonstrate you operate at, it doesn't matter what else you may have written. You have spoken here of your enthusiasm for Merkley and the question was whether your enthusiasm extends to his silence in the face of this barbarity.

Ms Mel Harmon, the same question to you: Are you too complicit in the savagery or do you denounce Merkley's, Wyden's, and Obama's failure as elected Democratic leaders to speak out against it?

To all three of you: Do you support what Bill Bodden references here, the the resolution that Democrats in the Congress will be sponsoring. It's a "Yes" or "No" question you can answer directly. And will you be fulfilling your responsibility as a citizen to call your Oregon representatives you say you choose to confine your interest to Carla to express your opinion? That's also a "Yes" or "No" question. Just as the only vote Merkley and Wyden will have is "Yes" or "No".

The more you people behave as you do, the more it reflects poorly on you. I encourage you to demonstrate to the rest of the readership exactly what is wrong with the people who define the Democratic Party here in Oregon as we look forward to Wyden's re-election run in 2010.

Carla you obviously have heard a lot of empty cliches that you pull out when you think they fit. You are, as I said, a prime example of the kind of empty intellect that exults form over substance.

The questions are clear. You only want to try to deceive people into believing they "loaded" because they are moral questions with unambiguous portent (and probably in the past you've been able to talk your way out with empty assertions like this because of the kind of people you choose to try to gain stature with).

Either you support Merkley and Wyden's silence on what Israel has been doing, or you don't support their silence. You know you will be judged based on those answers because they go to the questions of morality and values, and possibly loose social status with a group of people with whom you want to have status.

You can ignore me all you want and everyone including me could care less. But you can't ignore the reality that there is an open question out there about the quality of your character that you create because you don't answer. You think this is about "you", when really is about how you like those you associate with represent a set of political values.

You are exhibit #1 why, as I said, we as Democrats are as over as the GOP. With any luck, in the 2010 election we are going to see real change in the form of a voting majority of people as disaffected by this kind of behavior by Democratic partisans as they are by the behavior of Republican partisans, and who put their energy, money, and votes behind candidates who represent them. All we have to do to build that coalition is keep asking the question as I've done here whether our values are really being represented by the people who claim to represent us now and the people like you who defend them with studied refusals to answer.

You are exhibit #1 why, as I said, we as Democrats are as over as the GOP.

Even if true, it's the writing that counts, no? I think WeThe's basically sound logic suffers from an attempt to create politico-cartoon surrogates for the convenient placement of aggression. Just my silly advice, but I'd give that a rest. Like I say, you'll find support for the logic if you stick to behavior and not straw men and women.

Everyone understands anger; that's progressive. Harry, Joel, Jiang, Kevin, myself- we're all pretty angry dudes. It would be nice if that energy were more applied to sharpening our steely barbs.

Just keeping to the point that it is the silence of Merkley and Wyden that is the issue, pointing out that their defenders refuse to either condone or condemn the silence of those they defend is neither bullying, insults, or a straw-man argument. We are talking about behavior for all the world to see, and commenting on that is hardly dishonorable.

In the meantime, let's recall we are talking here about the local face of moral paralysis. Although the cliche "think globally, act locally" is shopworn, this is exactly the kind of situation in which the truth behind that cliche lies.

For those who haven't seen it, read Ron Wyden's statement released late today and judge for yourself. He speaks for you and your values to the world if you don't speak for yourself.

Either you support Merkley and Wyden's silence on what Israel has been doing, or you don't support their silence.

To resurrect the old saw, all that is needed for evil to succeed is for good men (and women) to do nothing or be silent.

As for Wyden's statement it is slightly less pro-Israel than I expected but well short of what I would have liked to have read. Like all others, he fails to make a reference to the human rights abuses inflicted by Israel against Gaza for many months.

From Wyden: "America, and the new Obama administration, must use all their influence to bring that about.”

I don't know what "influence" he was talking about, but it is unlikely to include moral authority.

Now what does Merkley have to say?

Although Kevin obviously has his own personal issues, people will notice that my first post was only after several others took the opportunity to express their enthusiasm and support for Merkley. Including this from a sad and miserable person signed "Kevin": That picture and who is in it represents the end of our national nightmare..

The news reports I cited make it clear we face even worse turmoil in the mideast if the U.S. does not change policy towards Israel because of the 700+ innocent people, including 100+ children, they have butchered in their psychotic rampage. I for one am going to hold people like Carla, Kevin and the rest accountable for their support of Merkley and Wyden. My hope and belief is that the 2008 election is also a turning point for Oregon and national politics away from what has become an ugly, petty, incompetent Democratic Party, just as surely as the GOP has rendered itself irrelevant for at least two election cycles.

Carla and Kevin are obviously too limited to appreciate they were in fact given the courtesy of an opportunity to disassociate themselves from statements such as Wyden made today and Merkley's silence (except for his vote on the Senate resolution completely echoing Wyden's statement), and the failed, incompetent leadership they represent. Carla and Kevin not only didn't do that, they instead lashed out, to the point of throw all manner of empty cliched responses as children are quite appropriately taught to do in their first years of grade school as they are becoming socialized because they are not yet able to reason and respond with the experience and sophistication of adults. Quite a testimonial for the politics they represent and the politicians they support.

700+ innocent people, including 100+ children,

If you've butchered 700+ innocent people, what does the second bit add, besides attempting to elicit a genuflection at the mention of the holy and revered word, "children".

Yuck. Stale logic v. Stale spin.

Actually, if you'll scroll up to the top you'll see that "the issue" is the fake photo-op with Cheney and Merkley.

The original post on this thread was really a non-issue that would have gone nowhere if it hadn't been sidetracked to one of more substance. Outside of his family and a few close friends, Merkley's swearing-in will be forgotten in short order.

The Israeli-Palestine conflict has already endured more than 60 years and has the potential to continue for generations. Gaza may prove to be to Israel-Palestine what the Battle of the Boyne was to Ireland. It was fought in 1690 and is still "fought" in the minds of some Irishmen to this day.

Re: "The news reports I cited make it clear we face even worse turmoil in the mideast if the U.S. does not change policy towards Israel because of the 700+ innocent people, including 100+ children, they have butchered in their psychotic rampage."

And, since we are Americans, not Israelis, we must also recognize that our continuing support for Israeli crimes endangers our own children. The more we support the slaughter, torture and humiliation of the Arab and Muslim world, the greater the chances are that we will again be attacked, and that the crazed right-wing backlash that we witnessed after the last attack will be redoubled and will advance the interests of the far-right.

. Gaza may prove to be to Israel-Palestine what the Battle of the Boyne was to Ireland.

They both prove to me that religion kills. God worship is a hobby. Lots of people feel that their hobby is really important. You wouldn't accept a war to win back some really nifty golf greens, you wouldn't invade a country because the beaches are great for surfing, and you shouldn't go to war because your God justifies it. I run a charity based on the premise that "cricket is religion". I'm very serious about that and mean it in a very, very serious social sense, a Kantian ethical imperative. Any Orangeman that would shed blood against the Papists today, or any terrorist wanting to kill infidels, is no different than my advocating for a military occupation of Pakistan because they aren't playing enough Test cricket. It's laughable. That doesn't mean I regard the point as less. I'm very concerned about Pakistan's cricket. I think if they had their cricketing house in order, Benazir Bhutto would be alive today. Seriously, looking at Pervez Musharrif's behavior as patron of Pakistan cricket, his using Pakistani attachees to intervene in a Test at the Oval in 2006, his handling of international issues, one could see where the country was heading since early 2004. If Pervez had an ounce of sense he could have at least made a point to baby Bush about sport and international differences when they were touring a bowling academy. Pervez could have pointed out how the odds of military action were much less, because of cricket. This was at the same time we were continuing to ban Cuban ball players from playing in the US. But military action based on those beliefs just isn't how you win countries and influence population. It doesn't matter how important you think it is.

I will no longer discuss politics with someone that insists on bringing their childhood superstitions, i.e. religion, to the table in a responsible debate on policy. The Gaza situation has nothing to do with religion. Most Hammas and Mossad would change religions at the drop of a hat if their favorite hobby were gone and someone else offered them a new game. All war is about male primates setting a social challenge to see who will attend the hunt. On the hunt, doing what the great male says earns you a lasting place in the social order, particularly if the behavior required is extreme or socially unacceptable. Check out your movie offerings tonight. How many are about a great man going on a hunt? You find that entertaining, then want to discuss what should be done in Palestine? Animals!!! Those people are in the Gaza situation for identity and population control. Naturally that leads to everyone that is stupid enough to buy that load on the face of it either identifying or vilifying. Population control is never discussed openly; always a side-effect of policy, so we discuss their religion.

And, since we are Americans, not Israelis, we must also recognize that our continuing support for Israeli crimes endangers our own children.

Must?!? Not realizing it is what led to 9/11! Why would we do that now? The results are predictable and richly earned. If I lived in a free country, I might add some Greenspan defined emotion to that, which acronym does not stand for "Internet Explorer"!

Besides, it has been taken as a part of the "support our troupes in the Gulf" mentality that any discussion of those factors in relation to 9/11 is unpatriotic, gives aid and comfort to the enemy, and, well, is just very, very, un-American! Has anyone in the mainstream moved beyond Bill Maher's timidly stating, "uh, they weren't cowards"? I'm sure he would take that back now. Now and sure being the operative words. 30 years ago it was written in the Village Voice that discrimination against Arabs would thrive among left and right equally, determining most policy for 50 years. I was amazed at the time that no "progressives" would discuss it. Lack of interest.

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