I think part of the problem is that lots of folks believe (and you seem to imply this as well, Kristin) that Obama wants to do all of these things on your list.

1) end the war--Obama mostly wants to downsize the Iraq war while expanding it elsewhere; 2) fix the economy--Obama was a chief cheerleader for the Wall Street bailout; 4) piece the Constitution back together--Obama voted for the FISA bill;

Don't get me wrong--I'm glad the guy one, and I agree that we need to organize to make these things happen. It's just that I think we need to be realistic about where we're starting from.

Did I really write that "I'm glad the guy ONE"? What a weird and dyslexic typo. Too bad you can't edit around here...

For me, that includes continuing to fight for marriage equality – the anti-gay marriage measures were a tear-inducing loss in an otherwise amazing evening.

Tear inducing - and firmly backed by the usual suspects: the Catholic Church, the Mormon Church, and many white and black protestant congregations.

The common factor: religious prejudice.

** If you really want to reverse successful efforts to deny full equality to your gay and lesbian friends, family, neighbors, etc...

STOP GIVING MONEY TO THE CATHOLIC, MORMON, AND PROTESTANT CHURCHES. Your donations are used to lobby legislators, and run political campaigns, to selectively erase our basic civil rights.

SPEAK OUT AGAINST RELIGIOUS PREJUDICE. Referencing an invisible supernatural deity, and how much he, she or it hates lesbians, is not a sufficient reason to amend state or federal constitutions to undermine America's promise of equality for all.

LET YOUR PRIEST, IMAM, BISHOP, RABBI KNOW THAT GAY AND LESBIAN AMERICANS ARE HUMAN - JUST LIKE THEY ARE. Because too many religious leaders see us as something inhuman, and less deserving of constitutionally protected rights.

LEAVE THE CHURCH, OR TEMPLE. Without parishioners to fund or promote heinous, un-American, "faith-based" efforts to reduce the legal worth and value of gay and lesbian Americans - they won't be able to do it any more.

Well, not all Protestant churches. Sure, some like the Southern Baptists, do what you say. But others, like the Unitarians, do not.

True enough. (But are the Unitarians even religious?)

I can't tell you how many productive conversations I've had since the election - and how many embarrassed Catholics and black protestants I've spoken with (I don't know any practicing Mormons). Several have promised to speak up, and even leave; some noted that they'd effectively left years ago, by not attending church...

How could you still belong to an organization that uses your money to amend state constitutions to deny women the right to vote? Or Filipinos the right to assemble? Or blacks to marry whites? Gays and lesbians, and our families, are just as real.

A widespread sense is that the Catholic, Mormon, and Baptist churches have done themselves harm in the long run by spear-heading these profoundly un-American efforts to cut gay and lesbian citizens off from equal civil protections. Particularly among younger people, who don't share the prejudice of their elders and, when educated, tend to take the supernatural assertions with a grain of salt.

OB: why not ask my last girlfriend, who asked me to help her to carry a baby... if you were on-target with your vitriol in my direction? Jesus. You are the arch-sentimental cause, but you are raving up here as if you have landed square amongst the enemy. Or maybe I should give you kudos, for my family, the native community, earn an eloquent, ignorant shrug as people just move on to what little they do know and continue the group regurg. And me, I do not quite have the balls to keep spitting in their faces, ignoring any and all hands extended to keep up the circular rant until I see some feet walking, some faces averted and some kind of anything but a friendly hand.

You seem unable to invite anyone to SAY if they did something during this last pass. However, I notice that when I did, that just got silence and nobody gave a damn. So maybe you are right,and your way of going about things here is just what blogging is about: rant, rave, discourse in the negative. This is how it is done.

I am just pointing out that I sure got a lot of your sneaker marks on me, and you were stepping all over someone a lot like you. As Civiletti pointed out in a different thread when Boddin or Kershner or some ofther professional uber liberal shithead was jumping me for mentioning the Winter Soldier hearings, and Veteran's Day activities meant to help the wounded Vets heal themlseves, their communities and voice their opposition to the damages of warmaking..... he at least they respect, as one of thier own who was more than just a spinmeister or such... so he stopped them by pointing out that some people do this work we all supposedly are doing by healing the spiritual... he did not point out that the monomaniacal fools were off-target. They were vituperating activities that SAY NO WAR! Heh.

My experience with you is that same. I'm on your side, Billy. But because I don't say just the same phrases, you, like the Babdists et. al. thinmk I'm not the real thing. Neither you nor they will accept my testimonial until it is in the precise slogans and phrases that you consider "right".

You need to think about whether you resemble your enemy in any way you want to change. The chilling effect you are having on anyone not just like you is... chilling.

I say it again: my placement on the spectrum of adjustment aligns me with you; my work in the past aligns me with you; my natural philosophical bent aligns me with you.

But I'm not loaded with the biblical passages you expect of me to recognize this: I am in alignment with you by choice and by thrownness. I CHOSE the churches I attend, Billy. I did not STAY, EVER with a nasty, closed minded church. I CHOSE congregations that were "reconciling". Do you know that term? Get educated if you don't. THey are working politically iwthin the Methodist church to have gay clergy, etc. THat's my church. WAS my church.

So: what were you attacking in my person? Can you even remember?

And: why did I just waste a few more minutes here in the wasteland?

So: what were you attacking in my person? Can you even remember?

OK... so I thought I wasn't the "center of your universe".. (!)

RW -

My point is: if you attend a church that works hard to disenfranchise my family from basic civil protections, for shockingly indefensible religious reasons ("the aliens told me so," "my goddess believes gays can only marry fresh leeks," "my holy book has a passage stating men can't lie with men - and I should stone my son to death if he gets lippy"), then you're part of the reason my family suffers inequality right now.

These churches are no secret - they are the primary financial backers of Prop 8 and Measure 36: the Catholic Church, the Mormon Church, and many white and black Protestant churches. The Unitarians (bless their hearts) aren't the problem.

But if you attend and contribute to a Catholic, Mormon, or one of many Protestant churches, your support has diminished my family's equality under US law. And if you want to help move us forward towards equality for all Americans, stop supporting your Catholic, Mormon, or Protestant church. Stop it right now.

Yip yip!

I know a lot of Southern Baptists like myself who have just stopped attending a church.

I think it's happening all over. I've heard that Rep. Chip Shields left the Catholic Church. My husband's uber-Catholic aunt, who once suggested we don't "throw the baby out with the bathwater," recently decided to dump Damien overboard, too...

I think you have to first see gay and lesbian people as people - real people, with families, and lives, and contributions to make to our society. Then it's obvious - all Americans deserve the same civil protections. But if you're uneducated, fearful, and justify dehumanizing someone gay or lesbian because of religious prejudice, utterly baseless and evidence free, but trumpeted by Catholic, Mormon and Protestant churches - then perhaps "they" aren't as deserving. "They" are not like us.

It's time that organizations that routinely demonize my family (i.e., the Catholic, Mormon, and many Protestant churches), and spend significant time and money to deny us equal rights, start losing self-respecting, educated, honest, caring and compassionate parishioners...

Catholics, Mormons and Protestants can make this change.

Will Hillary Clinton be a great Sec. of State ? Hillary Clinton would have been an excellent president.Yes and would love to see her in there. Respecting Obama's process but yes ! Will she take the job ? Thank-you for the connect to Obama !Lots of communication about religion and if you haven't read, "Signature Of God,Handwriting of God" by Grant Jeffery's,it's an interesting, interpretation of perspective.See ya'll later !

<h2>A lot is going on for Public Education and we have to meet the needs with resources of American school buildings. We have to sink the NCLB and 10% mandates on PL 107-110.We need a bail out package too ! Looking for one fire truck and a marching band,grab Guskey and Marzano to motivate and engage.Get the school buildings what they need first and then see strategic planning for reform.These radical reinforcement ships sailing on NCLB and 10% are going to sink.Provide resources and support to your public school buildings.Read Manufactured Crisis !Watch the Fire Department commericial ! Ya got kids in public school buildings ? Yeah ! Do it ! Evaluate teachers and principles support needs and survival kits.Anacostia High in DC needs a rodent and cleaning team. See all inner city principles for their list of what they need to operationally run their business. Public Education rises from the ashes and makes come back ! We've had it with the bad press ! Look out, teachers are unplugged and unleashed !We want a US Teacher rally in DC !We could get Hillary and Obama to speak !Academic freedom with creativity and and bubble that !</h2>