Gordon Smith admits he's a conservative, not a moderate
Kari Chisholm
I've been on a bit of crusade to get the media to stop calling Gordon Smith a moderate. Now, he's admitted on camera that he's a conservative Republican. If there was any question before, there shouldn't be anymore. Hopefully, this'll put to rest that ridiculous "leading GOP moderate" canard.
On the jump, check out the video from the new GordonSmith.com:
(And just in case his people pull the video, you can see it here.)
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Aug 5, '07
It's so "folksy" how can you not want to click and "help"?
8:36 a.m.
Aug 5, '07
Even if I didn't have more compelling reasons to vote against Smith this time around, and there are plenty, my then-perception of him as a genuine moderate was a key reason why I voted for him in the past.
It seems clear to me that Smith is nervous about his chances this election and that's why he's making kissy face with the GOP base in order to try to galvanize support.
Aug 5, '07
Smith may say he is a conservative, but that won't keep some people from believing he is a moderate and a nice man. Therein lies the problem for any candidate wanting to unseat Smith in 2008. His or her campaign must wake up this legion of political sleepwalkers and bring them in touch with reality. The other problem is to define what "conservative" means. Conservative should mean the opposite of waste. Has there ever in the US Congress been a more wasteful policy than the war on Iraq supported by Gordon Smith? The abysmal Madeleine Albright on behalf of the severely flawed Clinton Administration said of the US-inspired UN sanctions on Iraq that the premature deaths of half a million children were worth it. Will Smith and his fellow conservatives say of the thousands of people slaughtered, maimed and damaged psychologically and the trillions of dollars spent that the war on Iraq was worth was worth that cost? Was it worth it if it meant the unjustified US invasion of Iraq encouraged hatred of the US throughout a region in the world with people that remain incensed over the Crusades that occurred nearly a millennium ago?
Aug 5, '07
Mr. Bodden is right on point, perhaps he should throw his hat in the ring.
Excellent comment !
10:28 a.m.
Aug 5, '07
He'll just say that he's a "moderate conservative."
And it's all in the context -- perhaps if you compare him to Sam Brownback or James Inhofe, he is more moderate than they are.
But talk about damning with faint praise! Of course he's conservative. He's very conservative. His political views - as expressed in his votes - are way out of step with the majority of Oregonians.
But in recent election cycles politics has become more and more like theater, and he's exploited that trend very skillfully. It's our job to get the word out about his actual votes, not the stuff people see in a six second sound bite on CNN or the network news.
Aug 5, '07
Mr. Bodden is right on point, perhaps he should throw his hat in the ring.
A much better candidate beat me to it. His name is Steve Novick.
Aug 5, '07
Bill Bodden: "Will Smith and his fellow conservatives say of the thousands of people slaughtered, maimed and damaged psychologically and the trillions of dollars spent that the war on Iraq was worth that cost?"
Bill holds one standard for Smith and another for himself. On the Independence Day blog, Bill and I had the following exchange.
Bill: "South Korea can be claimed to some extent as a just war because it led eventually to the democracy that now exists there."
I then said that the only way to reconcile those comments on the Korean War (a war not declared by Congress) with his position on Iraq is to concede that from Bill's point of view, history will determine how just or unjust this illegal war in Iraq really is.
To that Bill replied: "Just because the Korean War could be claimed to some extent as a just war on the basis that South Korea eventually became a democracy doesn't mean the same future will apply to Iraq. It may, but then again it may not."
Do you hear that folks: in Bill's world, the end justifies the means! If Iraq is a democracy 30-40 years from now, Bill will classify the war "a just war" after all.
On that same Independence Day blog, Bill described himself this way: "I'll try to remain fixed in the extreme center."
To most of us, that's another way of saying flip-flopper or fence-sitter. So much for your ctiticism of Gordon Smith...keep us posted on the view from the fence, Bill.
11:15 a.m.
Aug 5, '07
Now, if we could just focus energies expended on the post above on Gordon Smith instead of on an ally, we might just win this election...
Aug 5, '07
Does Smith not sound incredibly depressed about this campaign? He's not even bothering to put on his sweater anymore, and he practically cried on the word "Republican."
Anyway, the link doesn't work, but the video's on YouTube.
Aug 5, '07
Kristin: Now, if we could just focus energies expended on the post above on Gordon Smith instead of on an ally, we might just win this election...
Yes, I agree. Let's not challenge one another to be intellectually honest. If we can just be a bunch of "go along to get along" cheerleaders and ignore the inconsistency of our own message, that will convert the undecided nonthinking sheeple and bring Gordo down for sure. My bad.
12:00 p.m.
Aug 5, '07
man, that is a pillow-soft appeal. He seems so emasculated.
12:36 p.m.
Aug 5, '07
Emasculated is a great description of his tone in the video. Almost like he's ashamed to admit this is an audience he has to genuflect to.... its kinda like Hillary genuflecting to the folks at the Yearly Kos.
Aug 5, '07
Wow... Gordon Smith "admits" that he's NOT a Democrat. Shocking!!! :-D
Labels like "Liberal", "Conservative", and "Moderate" are often used in more relative than absolute terms.
So listen again to Smith's words. He establishes first that "we" (him and his target audience) are Republicans. He reinforces that assertion by saying that "we" are conservatives.
It seems to me that he's making that relative comparison to non-Republicans, i.e., Democrats.
Compared to a Democrat, of course Smith is a conservative. I doubt anybody in the state thinks otherwise.
That doesn't in any way contradict his (and others') claims that compared to some Republicans, Smith is a moderate. Even if that assertion is untrue, this specific video doesn't prove the point.
Now, why would Senator Smith feel the need to stress that as a Republican, he's conservative compared to a Democrat?
Because he faces trouble from the far-right in his own party. Of course he'd rather not be challenged from the right in a primary.
I see this particular phrasing as a way to remind Republicans that the likely alternative to Smith (should he be defeated) would be a less conservative Democrat, not a more conservative Republican.
Smith's biggest weakness right now, I think, is the possibility that the more conservative members of his party won't turn out to support him in the general, precisely because they think he's not conservative enough.
I gotta figure, if you're pissing off both the left-wing and the right-wing in your state, there actually is a pretty good chance that you are moderate.
But that's coming from someone who considers himself moderate, and who doesn't much care for either party because of it. FWIW.
1:21 p.m.
Aug 5, '07
To the base Smith is trying to connect to, "conservative" means moderate. In some ways, we're all moderate in our own minds.
Aug 5, '07
David, Smith's message boils down to, "I'm a Republican like you, and I'm a conservative like you." But when he's not talking to conservative Republicans, he's going to flip-flop and say, "Look how moderate I am!" He can't have it both ways.
2:28 p.m.
Aug 5, '07
He can't have it both ways.
Of course he can. Politics isn't about what's real, it's about creating new realities. That's why we measure --some of us, anyway-- the credibility of office seekers not by what they stand for, but how much money they can raise.
While a "moderate" Democrat is far better for Oregonians than a "moderate" Republican (conceeding those terms mean and define nothing anyway) it's going to take a knock out punch to win the race. The question should be who is best positioned to deliver one, and I'd almost always say it's the underdog who is hungry and has a fire in his belly for the fight.
Smith sounds like he's on the ropes, dispirited at best. It's time to go in for the kill...
2:31 p.m.
Aug 5, '07
Not to get too far off topic...
I feel those who compare (or try to compare) Iraq to the war in Korea are sadly mistaken. Yes, South Korea did end up becoming a full fledge democracy (granted it really took until the late 80's for even that to happen since many of the years between the establishment of the ROK and then were pure dictatorships). However, take into consideration how many times we literally screwed Korea (sorry there's not other way to put it) in terms of the decisions we made on their behalf.
Having lived there for three plus years, I can tell you that they are still weary of us. We treat them like a little kid on the block and show them very little respect. It just goes to show how bullying doesn't pay off in the long run. Yes, on the diplomatic front everything may smell like roses, but underneath it there is a hell of a lot of resentment toward our country from Koreans.
Tying this back into the conversation (or at least trying to) Smith and Bush want you to believe that we are fighting a just cause because we are the liberators of the Iraqi people.
Smith is so wishy washy on his stance on Iraq, he says one thing and then does another. Both he and Bush talk out their ass about what we are doing for Iraq. I guess using the example of Korea doesn't really boade well for those pro-war fanatics.
2:32 p.m.
Aug 5, '07
DJ -- You're right! Wow -- sorry. I had forgotten how far that kind of strategy got us in 1980, and how it ushered in a long, brilliant Democratic era.
btw -- nothing against intellectual honesty, just hope you're focusing just as much energy against Smith as you are against people who are, in the end, voting just like you.
2:56 p.m.
Aug 5, '07
South Korea did end up becoming a full fledge democracy
And how many troops do we still have there?
And, not to get too Asian history wonky...but South Korea? It's funny but Korea, as a country, predates any division north and south by a few thousand years.
I'm as old as the Korean War. Is that what we want for Iraq?
Smith is the "conservative" but Congress just passed a gazillion dollar defense budget, and we've still not brought home the troops from Korea.
Isn't it about time?
Aug 5, '07
Every press release and campaign statement from a Democrat regarding Smith should introduce him as "self-identified conservative Republican" Gordon Smith. The fact that he calls himself a conservative Republican needs to be repeated as many times as possible to scrub from people's minds any idea that the guy who gives billions of our money away to the same corporations who give him his millions -- that's billions per corporation, the guy who reliably votes for President Bush's policies a full 9 out of 10 times, the guy who strongly supports the Iraq War until he has to face the voters and then does nothing to actually end it, that this guy could be anything but the conservative Republican he tells his donors he is.
4:51 p.m.
Aug 5, '07
I find it amazingly ironic that his lowest job ratings come from the very middle he seems to seek salvation from. The last SUSA, for those who haven't seen it:
Dems 48% approval GOP 52% approval NAV 41% approval
The Dems number is higher than it's been, but down from when he first claimed he was against the war. The GOP number is the lowest since May 2005, possibly longer (it only goes back that far). And as I recall that NAV number hasn't been much lower in two years, either. But it's definitely a red flag for Smith. He's bottomed out with his base to the point he has to re-establish cred, and the indies aren't buying his shtick at ALL. Thus...
The Oregon Democrat: Gordon Smith's saving grace.
5:43 p.m.
Aug 5, '07
Frank,
We still have about 37,000 troops in South Korea and keep pushing to try to lower that number. However, the ROK government is against lowering the number of US troops because they feel they act as a "tripwire" to prevent another invasion by North Korea (recall the Korean War was started by the North's invasion as they were trying to reunify the two Koreas). The public perception is split, in that many of the younger people don't want our troops there and the older generation (especially those that fought along side the US troops in the Korean War) still appreciate us.
Those who support the war should be asking themselves how long are we going to have to have troops there and how many thousands troops will have be stationed in Iraq. Korea was nothing like Iraq. There was no insurgency, no terrorists (granted the only reason they are there because we invaded the country)in Korea.
Meanwhile Smith hides in his office and keeps repeating the "I'm a moderate" matra. His outrage at what is going on in Iraq is so phoney it's disgusting.
5:56 p.m.
Aug 5, '07
Just a side note on Korean history, the Korean peninsula was only divided after WWII. Although the division was never meant to be permanent, the North half of Korea (roughly above the 38th parallel) administered by the USSR and the Southern part of the country administered by the US. When both countries went to set up governments they set up ones that were complimentary to their own systems. Hence part of the reason for the two countries.
It should also be noted that the US signed off on a treaty allowing the Japanese annexation of Korea in the early 20th centuary. These are two of the reasons I stated up thread that the US has repeatedly screwed Korea.
My question is, if we did this to Korea what the heck are we going to do to Iraq.
Aug 5, '07
You know, there should be an ad made on "Gordon Smith's Values" repeating Smith's "The values that make us Republicans, that make us conservatives" in between examples like,
"Gordon Smith gives tax holidays to the corporations that fund him.
"Pfizer got $11 billion.
"Oregon got $0 billion."
"The values that make us Republicans, that make us conservatives"
"Gordon Smith votes with Bush and the Republicans 9 out of every 10 times."
"The values that make us Republicans, that make us conservatives"
Etc.
Aug 5, '07
What’s wrong with being conservative, it’s a lot better then being liberal! Liberals tend to be limp wristed and soft, couldn’t defend themselves if the had an army in front of them. We send our best and brightest people to war, more often then not those people are conservative. I would cry if this country had to be defended by liberals, they would mow us down in a hart beat! Kari, I just can’t see an M16 in your hands, you don’t seem like the type.
Aug 6, '07
Smith Is not now or will he ever be a conservative. He is a little to the left of The entire faculty at PSU. i won't vote for him Too Pro Gay and Anti Defense for me.
8:45 a.m.
Aug 6, '07
"We send our best and brightest people to war,"
to do what? Not fight it--we're taking any derelict and moron we can find to fight this war. To cover it? Hah--two words: Judy Miller.
Our best and brightest appear to be the ones who have quit or been fired, and are now running for office (Sestak, Murphy, Duckworth, Hackett, et al). And strangely, they're all (relative) liberals.
Aug 6, '07
I don't know what happened to my response to DJ last night, so I'll try again.
First of all, DJ is obviously a troll and given this - "Do you hear that folks:" - it appears he is probably a Limbaugh dittohead, one of the worst kinds of trolls because they only understand what Rush spews at them.
It would be pointless to try to persuade DJ otherwise, but there may be some impressionable people reading his screeds so we can't let him get away with his nonsense.
What DJ obviously didn't pay attention to and failed to appreciate was the qualifier I used in the thread he went back to - "to some extent."
DJ: This phrase is commonly used when referring to some event, person or a group of people to note a point that attributes something that is good or bad. Careful readers, however, will recognize that when all the facts are considered the final conclusion may be much different, even the opposite. Careless readers (DJ?) will take a point and make the most of it while ignoring other points that may be contradictory to the position they want to take. This latter approach is a fundamental aspect of intellectual dishonesty.
For example, Germany was an economic mess in the early 1930s. Hitler came along and boosted the economy putting lots of unemployed people back to work. So we could say in this case Hitler was to some extent good for Germany. However, as most of us know Hitler was an overall disaster for Germany. (I don't know what Limbaugh has taught his dittoheads about Hitler, so maybe DJ will disagree with that.)
As for the Korean War that DJ recycled, now that it is a thriving democracy we can say to some extent it was a just war, but we should defer to others much more knowledgeable about this event whether all the carnage was worth it. We would also do well at this point to consider the comment made by Zhou Enlai (Chou En-Lai) when he was asked towards the end of the 20th Century what he thought of the French Revolution (1789). "It is too soon to tell."
DJ again: Do you hear that folks: in Bill's world, the end justifies the means! If Iraq is a democracy 30-40 years from now, Bill will classify the war "a just war" after all.
If! And again, to some, but only some, extent.
To get back to Gordon Smith and the related topic. He has cast some votes that took moderate positions so <u>to some extent</u> it could be said he is a moderate, but if people look at his entire record he is closer to the right wing than moderates.
Aug 6, '07
Bill, I robbed a bank yesterday, killing two tellers and one armed guard in the process. When I got home, I went online and donated half of my take to a local women's shelter. Given my generosity, I guess you could say that to some extent it was a just bank robbery.
Keep us posted on the view from the fence, Bill.
Aug 6, '07