Damn straight, Alworth!

While I respect your comments most, of all of the regular Libs that post, I must dispute the over-arching blanket that you thrown over conservatives.

Are there slimy conservatives? Of course.

This is a case of not disclosing information that is going to come back to haunt the left more than the right.

How long did the Liberals know about this October surprise? If they knew about it many months ago (the instant messages that is), then why didn't this revelation become public way back? Back in time to help the young man who was the MANBLA object.

Did Libs sit on this information for political gain, at the possible expense of a minor? If this is shown to be the case, they will receive a reception not too different than the gay congressman from Florida.

Before we get too righteous, maybe we should find out who knew what and when.

Let's face it, regardless of one' political leanings, this country has a decency problem.

When you work so hard to take God out of the public realm (as we have), the basic Christian foundations of decency dissapear from society as well.

Congratulations ACLU. Maybe now you can understand why the Boy Scouts wanted to ban gay troop masters. The Catholic Church should have thought about this as well.

Jeff,

I agree that there isn't a correlation between sexual predators and orientation. I appologize for the incorrect connection.

However, I would say the exception is the Catholic Church based in part on how the Church is set up (altar boys).

If there is someone out there with the statistics to correct me please do. But it is quite apparent that the overwhelming majority of Catholic/Altar Boy abuse was Man/boy, not Man/girl.

Morality is not confined to sexuality. The slaughter, torture and ethnic cleansing of US-inspired, bipartisan-supported warfare in Iraq, Palestine and Lebanon are far more immoral than sex emails, even those sent to teenagers. A pox on both your houses.

I figured the reason the Foley thing wasn't jumped on, was it was so close to the way things were handled with Goldschmit's rape of his babysitter. You know what they say about Glass houses.

Your assertion that in ethics that one particular party is better than another is complete hogwash. THE reason the democratic party cant get traction is that they cannot really be honest either. Why dont you trot out some statistics on political scandals, and compare the scandal to resignations? I would bet far more "conservative republicans" end up bailing out by far over their dem counterparts. Neil Goldschmidt? Try slick Willie. Sexual relations my #ss.

Goldschmidt being a Democrat, must have been trying to use his government instrument to improve her life when he raped his baby-sitter.

Jeff's characterization of today's Republican party is a fine demonstration of today's Democrat party.

It's the at least three years of cover up that's going to hurt them the worst. Is Foley in rehab or has he just been disappeared. I guess that nobody who knew him thought he had a drinking problem.

Let's try this on for size, power in the absence of counter-balance creates a monster. That monster is arrogance. It is absolutely correct that the Democrats finally fared poorly after nearly 30 years in power. It has, however, only taken a little over a dozen years to get the Republicans into worse shape. That is worth considering.

People are people, so something else is amiss. You do the analysis for yourself, I'd suggest looking at policies & political alliances.

In case you haven't been over to my Blog, the rat bastards who voted "for" the Detainee Bill in Congress are in violation of their oath and traitors to America. Hope that's plain enough for the "R" trolls.

"Let's try this on for size, power in the absence of counter-balance creates a monster"

Are you talking about Portland? Oh I'm sorry. Ya'll don't talk about Portland corruption here.

You help it.

I think everyone can agree their is way to much money in politics making all our elected officials corrupt in one way or another. My Congressman has taken over 2 million from special interest durring his career and traveled all over the world on the special interest dime. DeFazio has even formed a group to invest New Zealand. We should through all of them out they have lost touch and represent only the themselves

"It were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should cause one of these little ones to fall into sin."

-Luke 17:2

Hypocrisy, (definition): "a feigning to be what one is not or to believe what one does not; esp : the false assumption of an appearance of virtue or religion. (Merriam-Wester's Collegiate Dictionary, Eleventh Edition.)

By their deeds shall you know them.

Yup.

More often than not, if you read an article about political shenannigans, you're going to find a little (R) next to the name. I suppose someone could try to prove that statment to be false, but I think they'd fail.

Chris, As someone who has been around politics for decades, I would love for that to be true. But unfortunately sometimes it isn't. Of course, it is harder to come up with such Democratic examples. Usually it is "we only want X to run so we'll tell all major donors not to contribute to Y" (isn't that what happened to Paul Hackett?) or something like Democrats for Hatfield, or misuing a bulk mail permit, or a caucus leader messing with bookkeeping and campaign filings. Of course, those last 2 were in the 15-20 years ago range.

Which is why it is important for every campaign to have a "no person"--the sort that says "no, we shouldn't do that". (Think of how a "no person" could have helped in the Edwards/ Curry situation.) Or "yes, that is the right thing to do", or "say it this way, not that way" or "document everything".

And why it is important to be exacting in public reporting like C & Es. Any political organization/ campaign / activist remembering the slogan "act so that you don't do anything you don't want on the front page of the newspaper" will not get into this kind of trouble.

And the reverse is true--arrogance can kill a campaign or a political career. Hubris is followed by nemesis.

The claim that Ds are sa corrupt as Rs strains credulity till it suffers as hernia. When considered along with the Rs claim to moral superiority, the Republican Party comes off as a stinking soup of rotting offal.

Tom Civiletti said: The claim that Ds are sa corrupt as Rs strains credulity till it suffers as hernia. When considered along with the Rs claim to moral superiority, the Republican Party comes off as a stinking soup of rotting offal.

You're correct. There's a dime's worth of difference. Dime's Worth of Difference, Alexander Cockburn. Frank Dufay is even more correct: There ain't nothing magical about being a Democrat unless it means something, and stands for something, besides NOT being a Republican.

Grow up, big money has bought both the R's and the D's, the majority power has shifted back and forth since Reagan and I haven't seen much good come out of DC for the common man in the last 25 years. You can sterotype eachother and say D's are bad or R's are bad, but until you address the problems of lobbyists and all the unfunded mandates and money flowing through congress that steer money to more money. I have run into a few politicos, but they are few and far between. For Goodness sake look at the governors race, Saxton has the Bar exposing his dealings with the PGE Texas Pacific Deal, but the Golden Man was right in there with him having our Current Gov. Ted, et al covering up for him for years just like Dennis H did with Foley. Get a life, and stop believing the D's are going to save you and start looking critically at all politicos and how to hold them accountable.

Patrick Kennedy? William Jefferson?

Rep. Frank Ballance

And from the "when they were kings" desk:

Dan Rostenkowski? ABSCAM?

What was the name of that wacko with the sideburns and the bad rug? I think he was from Ohio.

Mr. T: It has been interesting to watch the reaction of various Republican/ conservative famous people to the Foley story.

My hat goes off to Frank Luntz for the most genuine outrage.

It was as if he were saying "I spent how many years of my life building and maintaining the Republican majority for THIS to happen?".

From this time forward, I will have more respect for Mr. Luntz than for those who say "But the Democrats........."

One chronology I heard was that the original questionable emails came to light over a year ago. And if the House Republicans had dealt with those at the time, the rest of the country was so preoccupied with Hurricanes Katrina and Rita that no one would have paid much attention outside of Congress. There could have been a full investigation and a replacement process for Cong. Foley and never an election year scandal.

But the problem was that the folks who built their majority on "we're better than Rostenkowski, Jim Wright, the ABSCAM scandal or the House Bank Scandal, so elect us and we will restore values to government" didn't want to put protecting young people above protecting power.

So instead of getting all their leadership together (incl. Cong. Blunt who was in the leadership and seems to have more common sense than all the others put together) and coming up with a rational process, it was "let's play hot potato". Compartmentalize the leadership and do the old "not my job" routine because pages are someone else's job. Don't inform the whole Page Board, don't call all the leadership into a meeting to decide what to do, just ship it off to this guy Reynolds from NY who is head of the RCCC or whatever they call it.

Now they've admitted Foley's seat is gone, they will probably lose DeLay's seat, and maybe even Reynolds will lose his seat. And the only woman in the GOP leadership, Cong. Price, says anyone in the leadership who knew about all the Foley stuff last week should resign. She's in a tough race in Ohio, where Republicans are having a tough time.

Politicians have a choice: solve problems or play politics. See the topic about Stayton Mail's endorsement of Farmer Dan Thackberry to see what a growing number of Oregonians really want.

OR, just go around saying "But the Democrats...".

Republicans used to preach responsibility. Now they are saying that if a Republican does something wrong, it is the fault of Democrats. I think a growing number of people understand how stupid that is.

The way the Foley scandal is playing out is an excellent example of what happens when people willfully choose to treat homosexuals as some sort of criminals and further willfully confuse homosexuality with pedophilia. The former Congressman may be an alcoholic; he may be a homosexual; he certainly is a pedophile. But of course, these are all different potential aspects of an individual's life. The fundamental, glaring problem with what this guy and his handlers are doing is trying to cast his pedophilia as somehow the result of alcoholism. It's that old "devil made me do it" nonsense, the devil in this case being Demon Rum; your typical "Christian" right-winger seems to incline more to blaming things on the capital-D Devil.

Blaming the booze for trying to seduce teenagers, and then getting your press aide and lawyer and party higher-ups to spin this ridiculous story, is kind of like Mel Gibson blaming the booze for his bigotry, and then getting his press aide and lawyer to spin THAT ridiculous story.

We all have failings, and are all worthy of being treated with compassion. We also all need to accept responsibility for our actions, especially if they cause harm. I do not equate blaming Demon Rum with accepting responsibility; rather, it is deflecting responsibility.

Ex-Congressman Foley may well need treatment for alcoholism, but I would suggest he also needs psychological treatment to try to deal with pedophilia. His political-party affiliation and the question of whether or not he is gay are matters of complete indifference to me.

Remember a year ago when Jim West, mayor of Spokane, Washington was "outed" in a scandal comparable to what swallowed up Rep. Foley? And finally recalled from office?

In addition to being deserving of compassionate treatment, we all have an obligation to treat others the same way. It would be nice if the "Christian" right-wing accepted this bit of common decency.

Pat Ryan said "There is no legitimate comparison to be made between pedophiles and those who engage in consensual sex with other adults. Please remind the Republicans of this fact."

Why don't you remind that Democrat machine ACLU and NAMBLA who they defend?

Power corrupts. The majority party in Congress is always going to attract more unethical or illicit considerations. Why? Because THEY HAVE ALL THE POWER!

The Democrats have taken a power sabbatical, but they're still flying on lobbyist sponsored junkets, getting their relatives six figure part time jobs, and stacking bricks of cash in the freezer. No lo contendre might as well be the motto of the current Congress. Don't believe for one second that the Democrats actually want to put the kabosh on the K-street gravy train: they just want to move to the front of the line.

Cautionary note: if Nancy Pelosi gets one more face lift, she could lose the ability to speak. Back away from the botox, Congresswoman, we're from the government and we're here to help.

To all of the conservatives, or anyone else that fits in the stupid category: we're talking about the party leadership in the U.S Congress covering up for a child sex predator for up to three years. Why do I need to tell you this is not the same as something like accepting illegal campaign contributions or committing adultury? When in our history has the Democratic leadership covered up for a pedophile?

Melvin Jay "Mel" Reynolds was a Democratic member of the United States House of Representatives from the state of Illinois. In August 1994, he was indicted for having sex with a 16-year-old campaign volunteer. Despite the charges, he continued his campaign and was re-elected in November 1994. Reynolds initially denied the charges, which he claimed were racially motivated. On August 22, 1995 he was convicted on 12 counts of sexual assault, obstruction of justice and solicitation of child pornography. He resigned his seat on October 1, 1995.

While serving his sentence for the above crimes, he was convicted of bank fraud; wire fraud; making false statements to a financial institution; conspiracy to defraud the Federal Election Commission; false statements to a federal official.

Good ol' Mel got a Presidential Pardon from the Philanderer in Chief, Bill Clinton, on July 15, 1997. Good ol' boys gotta look out for one another, doncha ya' know.

Congress has a long and sordid history of protecting sexual predators and other wrongdoers in its midst. In the early 1980s, Republicans knew Rep. Daniel Crane (R-IL) had a fondness for young women and talk circulated on Capitol Hill that he was bedding a female page. Over on the Democratic side of the aisle, Rep. Gerry Studds (D-MA) preferred boys and his party tried to suppress stories about his affair with a 17-year-old male page.

Both scandals hit the fan in 1983, resulting in censure of both members on the floor of the House and reforms of the page system to provide more security. Crane, who cried and asked for forgiveness from the House colleagues, lost his re-election bid in 1984. Studds, however, refused to apologize and declared his homosexuality in a speech before the House. He won re-election easily and served several more terms before retiring.

Democrats controlled the House in 1983. In 1982, Speaker of the House Tip O'Neill had received numerous complaints about Studds' behavior along with requests that the Ethics Committee investigate Rep. Barney Frank (D-MA) whose boyfriend ran a gay prostitution ring out of the Congressman's Capitol Hill townhouse. O'Neill refused to act. A few years later, DC Vice cops arrested Frank's boyfriend and charged him with prostitution.

Where do you think Louisiana governor Edwin “Fast Eddie” Edwards’s came up with his pre-election day quip to reporters: "The only way I can lose this election is if I'm caught in bed with either a dead girl or a live boy".

Long ago, the age of consent in Washington D.C. was 12, but they raised it to 16 in 1993. These are modern times.

And no discussion of Congressional Sex Scandals would be complete without a mention of Good Time Charlie Wilson

In a 1988 Ms. Magazine piece by Molly Ivins, he provided the following justification for the hiring practices that had earned his secretarial staff the nickname Charlie’s Angels: “You can teach ’em to type, but you can’t teach ’em how to grow tits.” There were lots of rumors back in the day, when I worked on Capitol Hill. But Congressmen rarely got investigated if they had any kind of seniority.

None of what Mr. T says answers the question "why didn't the leadership deal with the Foley emails when they first became known?".

Especially if the report is true that they first became known over a year ago when many were preoccupied with Katrina?

Of course that is a rational question, and many would rather write the history of every scandal (haven't seen Wayne Hays and the Tidal Basin--was that with a woman named Fannie Fox?) than to ask "did Cong. Blunt have more common sense than Hastert, Boehner, and the rest of that crowd?". Or "Did Cong. Price, 4th in rank in the GOP leadership, say anyone who knew about the emails before last week should resign" as a statement of outrage or because she is in a tight re-election campaign and this isn't a good year to be a Republican in Ohio?".

LT:

I was merely responding to Brian's question,When in our history has the Democratic leadership covered up for a pedophile?

Answer: PLENTY OF TIMES, but they rarely make the newspapers.

Do you have any idea what "professional courtesy" means? Think of this as "political courtesy". The idea that a Congressman should be accountable to their constituents, rather than run of the mill laws and ethics, is as old as the Republic.

Why do you think Patrick Kennedy got a ride home instead of a field sobriety test?

LT-

What Mr. T did was give you examples, of D's covering up the same sordid behavior as the R's. That is what I was trying to say earlier, you need to hold individuals accountable for thier own actions and credibility and not let them hide as saints if they are D's and villians if they are R's. I think Foley is a good example to study, especially in the immage vs reality spectrum. What we need are more congress people like Darlene Hooley and Peter Defazio. I can't imagine either one of those folks chasing pages. If you have ever atteneded one of Darlene's many picnics or town hall meetings, she is so down to earth and understands what the craziness is all about. I am glad to see the post warning folks of the money pouring in for Ericson, so they get off thier duffs and help make sure she is not undermined in this election. In the same light I could not speak as about other Oregon D's, but the R Darlene replaced was pretty bad.

So what we have here is a see through accusation for political purposes…your knees must hurt.

Lets allude that what happened to one Republican officer is indicative of the entire party….but wait, that might be a little weak so let’s tack on a laundry list of other offenses by that party.

In order to appear (key word that) fair lets also say the the ‘other party’ is not perfect….but we don’t need to attach a laundry list. Americans won’t remember; Bill Clinton in the oval orifice; Ted Kennedy on a bridge; another Kennedy on trial for rape; Kerry before Congress …so why remind them.

Foley IMMEDIATELY stepped down for his vile actions….did Clinton?…no he dragged the entire nation through the painful and embarrassing process of lying, lying and more lying? Did Kennedy?…no he ran to his family for a cover up story.

But, it’s all about the kids right? Your horse must be 20 hands high.

Look, there is enough mud to sling on both sides, but on balance comparing the corruption between R's and D's is like comparing terminal cancer to tonsillitis.

It is unfortunate that it takes a quasi sexual scandal and cover-up to raise the ire of Republicans and yet the incompetance of this administration in just about every endeavor barely raises eyebrows. Very disappointing.

Did dan really start off with a couple comments first saying:

When you work so hard to take God out of the public realm (as we have), the basic Christian foundations of decency dissapear from society as well.

then immediately giving an prime example of this immorality, using the Catholic Church?

I'm confused, is the church our moral compass, or are they the pedophiles? Or, is it not this simple?

Here's another NPR Hatchet Job on a poor defenseless congressman who is being unfairly targeted

The October Surprise came late this year...Scroll past the first story until you get to

The Goldschmidt Affair Democrats, Sex Crimes and the Press

Remind me again why Denny Hastert should resign?